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'Rosa ruga Lindl.' rose Reviews & Comments
Discussion id : 84-108
most recent 22 DEC 17 SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 3 APR 15 by andrewandsally
Firstly, let me comment on the question of J Clare perhaps not being the breeder of 'Ruga' but simply the person sending it to John Lindley. This is, of course, possible: the passage of time makes certainty on this question impossible to achieve. BUT, why should he have done this - not just once, with 'Ruga' but also with 'Clare'? And where would he have acquired it? He would hardly have sent a French or English rose to Mr Lindley. It is extremely unlikely that another Italian breeder would have raised it. What candidates are there? The foremost breeders were Luigi Villoresi and Giovanni Casoretti and, rightly, there has never been any suggestion that either of them bred either 'Ruga' or 'Clare'.
Secondly, let me sum up my conclusion about the true identity of J Clare. In my book Le Rose Italiane I demonstrate that this was a pseudonym used by the 3rd Marquess Townshend, who lived in Italy from about 1809 until 31 December 1855. He also used the pseudonym "George Compton", echoing his real name of George Ferrars Compton Townshend. He was well-known in botanical circles, published authoritatively on Nelumbium cultivation, had a beautiful rose garden in Milan in the 1820s, lived briefly in Montebello (Mombello) and later at Blevio near Como before residing in Genoa, where he died.
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Reply #1 of 2 posted 22 DEC 17 by JJS
It took me some time to get to the bottom of it (I don't read Italian very well), but I tend to believe your arguments in "Le rose italiane", with, indeed, Joseph Clare's "On the cultivation of nelumbiums" as the pivoting publication.
In the same volume of the Transactions of the Horticultural Society (vol. VI, 1826) there is also a list of items that Joseph Clare sent to the Society. Among those items are drawings of seven roses, including Rosa Clare and "hybrid odorata Ayrshire rose" (would this be Rosa Ruga?). I wonder if those drawings still exist!
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Reply #2 of 2 posted 22 DEC 17 by andrewandsally
Well, it would be wonderful to find them! I think that if they had been at the London (now Royal) Horticultural Society they would have come to light by now. The other obvious place to look is in Como. I've done that and there are in the city library many paintings that were his but not by him. They seem to be from a Chinese source influenced by Castiglione. Among these there are some rose paintings but none of these are of roses associated with "Joseph Clare".
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Discussion id : 76-841
most recent 11 SEP 14 SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 21 FEB 14 by JJS
The description of this rose states that 'Ruga' was bred by Mr. Clare. I have my doubts.
In 1838 John Loudon wrote indeed “... brought from Italy, where it was raised by Mr. Clare”, but he refers to Lindley, 1830, who wrote "It was sent from Italy to the Horticultural Society by Mr. Clare.”
To me this means that Mr. Clare, an english gentleman (Clare is an English and also Irish surname) obtained the rose in Italy and sent it to England. Loudon clearly overinterprets Lindley's text.
We thus don't have a clue as to who actually raised 'Ruga'.
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Reply #1 of 4 posted 22 FEB 14 by Nastarana
I planted 'Ruga' last summer. I also grow 'Venusta Pendula'. Both came from Vintage Gardens and I would not expect VG to have sold the same rose under two names. If 'Ruga' blooms this spring, I will be able to tell if they are the same cultivar.
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Reply #2 of 4 posted 11 SEP 14 by JJS
Did you find out?
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Reply #3 of 4 posted 11 SEP 14 by Nastarana
No. VP is an established plant, but Ruga only barely survived the cold winter. It is growing now, but I likely won't get bloom from it for at least another season.
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Reply #4 of 4 posted 11 SEP 14 by Nastarana
No. VP is an established plant, but Ruga only barely survived the cold winter. It is growing now, but I likely won't get bloom from it for at least another season.
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Discussion id : 21-150
most recent 3 SEP 07 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 31 AUG 07 by Unregistered Guest
What is here pictured and described is an unidentified climber which has been sold as 'Ruga'. It does not match original descriptions of 'Ruga'.
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Reply #1 of 1 posted 3 SEP 07 by jedmar
Venusta Pendula is sometimes sold as Ruga.
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