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'Champneyana' rose Reviews & Comments
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The study labeled 'Cytological and molecular characterization of a collection of wild and cultivated roses' used growth shoot studies and found that Champney's Pink Cluster found at Real Jardin Botanico de Madrid was triploid. Blush Noisette and other indica roses in that study seemed to be the norm analysis. Someone more familiar with indica may want to look it over since I tend to gloss over studying roses not fit for my climate.
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#1 of 4 posted
31 MAR 22 by
 jedmar
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It is probable that some of the roses at Réal Jardin Botanico de Madrid are mislabeled. See also that they identified Rosa foliolosa Nutt. and Slater's Crimson China as triploid.
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I don't really know enough to know. I just saw it in a study so thought it worthwhile to mention.
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#3 of 4 posted
31 MAR 22 by
jedmar
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There was an extensive study of Blush Noisette by Malcom Manners, if I am not wrong. These were diploid, so Champneys should by rights also be diploid.
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Triploids can easily produce diploids, especially in like types. But I can easily see a nursery mistake being the easier explanation for an error in a scientific study. Most scientists are not rosarians. Most rosarians are not scientists. Only rarely do these paths cross-over, and even the best of rosarians can make a mistaken ID (especially with juvenile plants).
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ok folks, I have uploaded two pics today. Is it Champney's pink cluster? What is your opinion? It looked way more pink than most of the other photos.
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Does it have prickles? Wondering about Morletti, which turns up in the eastern states and WA, but not in SA, so I don't know it.
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#2 of 6 posted
9 OCT 21 by
DuchesseReply
#3 of 6 posted
9 OCT 21 by
Duchesse
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OK, I'll let someone else take over!
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#5 of 6 posted
9 OCT 21 by
Duchesse
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search function suggests abbandonata to me, but it has an eye like damasks. Shame. I'd like it to be abbandonata! I'll take any ideas or hints anybody has. Although Ringsfield House is 100 years old, I couldn't say that is how old the rose is.
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As a seriously off-at-a tangent comment: I didn't know Nanango had an old house with roses. I have heard of the "Nanango Forestry Tea" - if you come across it, it's William R. Smith. Good survivor rose.
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The Champneys commonly sold in Europe is a tall climber with flowers more double, darker and larger than Blush Noisette, it is also once flowering. The foliage doesn't match original descriptions (Many found in Dickersons book ie Less double than Blush Noisette, very pale pink and heavily clustering. 5 to 7 oval acute leaflets, narrower and longer than the leaflets of blush noisette). There are various reports of this rose being remontant and others, non remontant. I would guess that the rose was probably remontant with a background of 2 remontant roses and the excitement of the introduction. A found rose we have recently obtained has a probability of being correct, it appears the same as the rose at San Jose Heritage Rose Garden.
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A couple of expert rosarians have told me that all the plants they've seen labelled Champneys' Pink Cluster in Australia have been Blush Noisette. Still looking to see if we have the real thing here.
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#2 of 4 posted
23 AUG 21 by
Duchesse
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Margaret could you help me please. I am in Australia and I have just bought both Champney's Pink Cluster and Old Blush. (from the same supplier) are they different plants in Australia? I am just looking in The Royal Horticultural Society rose encyclopaedia who mark Champneys as a once bloomer. Here on HMF it says repeat bloomer. I'm confused. This significantly affects where I would plant it. Is it definitely a repeat bloomer in Australia? (the plant sold as Champneys)
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Old Blush should be a China, usually a bush unless it needs to climb to reach the light, and repeat-flowering.
Definitely different from Champney's Pink Cluster or Blush Noisette, which are scented Noisette climbers. It's likely you have Blush Noisette, so I'd go by the helpmefind page on that rose - repeat-flowering in flushes, climbs to about 2m.
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#4 of 4 posted
25 AUG 21 by
Duchesse
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The rose which was commonly sold in Europe originated from Beales,and is possibly an old Boursault rose. (maybe someone can identify it). We (La Roseraie du Desert) obtained our version from Greg Lowery (vintage gardens) California. and sold it for several years here in Europe. The Beales version still crops up occasionly
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