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'John Keats' rose Reviews & Comments
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My plant is two years old, going on three. It's own-root and has been slow to build.
It has proven quite healthy here in the heart of the Great Lakes. We are a water body moderated humid continental type climate with winter temperatures well above what our neighbours across the big lake in Wisconsin experience. Hot, humid summers with regular rain and occasional dry spells/droughts. Higher fire risks in upland, drier areas dominated by oak-hickory forests in the south and pines further north, but fire risk has been artificially mitigated due to human activity.
Winter hardiness over two winters has been impressive with no die-back and good cane hardiness so far. However, we have not had true zone 5 Winters for my area and quite some time and if we were to have a truly normal winter I would expect some die back if not all the way to the crown. Our average annual extreme low temperature is around -20° to -25° Fahrenheit. We have been experiencing more zone 6 and 7 Winters lately. It's great when we have normal snowfall because people freak out and act like it isn't normal. If we had another winter like 1978 then they might actually have something to be concerned with!
Unfortunately for me, I get no sense out of the lovely Colette. The blooms are very double and charmingly traditional in form. I do not consider the hybrid tea rose style bud and swirled exhibition center to be a classic rose form since it didn't come into existence until the roses from China in the 1700's to 1800's. It is very new comparatively speaking and those that call it the classic form have either no historical research done or short memory.
Further updates as I'm able
Z5b/Sunset 41 South Central Michigan
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Initial post
6 APR 22
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* Posted by unregistered site guest: Pending HMF administrative review. *
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After 3-4 years, I shovel-pruned this one. Too much disease, not enough blooms, too thorny.
I live in the humid subtropics of the Gulf Coast (zone 9a), and have neutral-pH, heavy clay soil, which I moderately amend with expanded shale or coarse sand for my roses. I top-dress my roses 1-2 times per year with about 2 inches of mulch. Earlier this year, I gave her a fertilizer spike.
I got Colette at an end-of-season sale. I kept her in a 15-gallon tub for the first year and a half. There's heavy fungal disease pressure here, especially with blackspot, and I don't treat. Colette was worse than most of my roses (which, to be fair to her, I mostly only grow roses with a strong reputation for disease resistance). She tended to get black spot unless in the PERFECT amount of sun. Part shade in the cooler half of the year? Blackspot within a week. Full sun in summer? Black spot within a week. Of course, EVERYTHING gets blackspot in August, but I don't worry about that too much. I moved her pot around several times per year, chasing the perfect amount of sun. Then I planted her in part shade (only the toughest of roses can handle full sun here).
I don't want to slander poor Colette. She is not a total, diseased mess. She never defoliates or loses canes to disease. I never fear that she'll die. She's pretty vigorous. But her leaves and canes just never look nice. There's always some minor cosmetic disease going on with them.
Untrained, she grows in a low fountain shape about 3'H X 8'W, with a good number of long canes that grow up for a bit, and then sideways for a while, and only modest branching. The shape can look rather nice planted among low shrubs with the canes snaking between her neighbors.
She puts out about 5-8 medium-sized apricot blooms in early- to mid-spring, with a nice fragrance of classic rose + Earl Gray tea. She's more fragrant than most roses, but like most fragrant roses, the smell does not waft. She shuts down blooming by April, and then gives another 1-5 blooms in fall. If untrained, she only blooms on the ends of her canes.
But training? No thank you. Never tried it, never will. She has big, sharp, abundant thorns--sort of in the 'New Dawn' category of thorniness. When I prune her, I only lift the canes by the leaves because there's nowhere to put my hands on the canes without hurting myself. The thorns were the deal-breaker. Sorry, Colette. Not for me.
She'd probably be a lovely rose in a cooler climate for someone who is more willing to use heavy rose gauntlets to properly train her.
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thank you for an excellent review. I have heavy & dense black clay. What are the roses that do well in your clay? Thank you.
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Initial post
12 MAY 06 by
Unregistered Guest
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Hi, How does your Colette grow? Vigorous? Lots of flowers? How often is the repeat? Is it Leggy? Would it bloom in lots of humidity in july and august? thanks so much..you have a fabulous rose list! terry
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I've only been exposed to three plants of this rose, and all three were in one garden along the coast here in Southern California, where there is little difference between summer and winter temperatures (compared to those inland) and there is fairly constant humidity. Based upon how those three plants performed, I never wanted to grow it anywhere else. The petals were too soft to deal with the humidity, losing color and balling terribly in one day. There wasn't much fragrance (likely due to the conditions being too damp and cool), but what there was, deteriorated into a foul smelling glob of sogginess. The year they were in the garden, there was constant mildew with bursts of black spot and rust. Yes, I know climbers require up to three years to come into their own and develop into decent plants. All three of these were planted as fifteen gallon plants, with between seven and eight feet of growth on them, so they were fairly mature specimen. PERHAPS, they may have improved with time, but neither the home owner nor I was willing to put up with how disappointing this rose was in that location. It's not the same color, but acceptable for this installation, and it's not as double, therefore not the same look as his wife originally wanted, but the three Collette were replaced with three Spice so Nice, which have been phenomenal! They're constantly in bloom; have good fragrance and are bullet proof in this location, with absolutely no disease, even though no cultural practices used on the Collettes were changed for Spice so Nice. The difference between the two roses performances are due entirely to the superior characteristics and suitability of Spice so Nice for these conditions. |
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Hi Kim,
What a coincidence...I was abbout to buy Colette to plant near my own Spice so Nice! As you know, the Spice So Nice has a much bolder coloration, and it IS healthy and beautiful and now around 18 feet tall (therefore I cannot bear ro get rid of it) but the orange tones in newly opened spice are stronger than I thought they would be when I planted it. (I love the softer two-day-old blooms.) I have an 1890's cottage, and love the old rose look...but with just a BIT more punch. I also have The Impressionist nearby. I thought the warm peachy pink of Colette between the two orange/gold/apricot climbers might bring some old-fashioned pink softness without clashing or contrasting too much. Can you think of another large bush/short climber similar in color and form to Colette that i might use that would do well in high humidity? I live in Western Maryland and the rose would be in a full-sun, south-facing, protected spot. I would be happy to e-mail you a photo (tried to upload photos to helpmefind but for some reason had trouble doing so.) THANK YOU!
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Hi Cynthia, Colette may or may not do well where you are. I don't know how much of the issues here along the coast were humidity related and how much was the lack of heat. In Malibu where they grew, "hot" was high seventies, low eighties. What's "hot" where you are? Black spot resistance is something I can't comment on because they've identified FIVE strains of black spot across the US. The "brand" I have is likely not the same one you have so what remains clean here may collapse under that pressure for you.
You might look at something like Westerland or Autumn Sunset. Not as double, but durable in most places and in similar coloring with great scent. They can be grown as shrubs or, left lightly to unpruned, develop into shorter climbers. Garden Sun might also be something which might be suitable. Conard Pyle, its introducer, states it has good disease resistance and cold hardiness.
I am leaning more toward the recent introductions rather than OGRs because they are easily available budded, so you'll have a leg up on growth and they may be more disease resistant and cold hardy in your climate. I hope it helps! Good luck.
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Hi Rosedabbler. A recent response to this comment just brought me back to read it. What did you select to go with your Spice So Nice? I hope all is good with you and yours. Happy New Year!
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#7 of 11 posted
31 MAR 16 by
LaurelZ
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When you replace any rose it get less fungal the first year. The real test would be how does Spice So Nice preform long term? Spice So Nice is a completely different color and not as pretty as Colette. And my Colette does great in San Francisco. In fact, it has much less fungal then any other of my roses in San Francisco. I do spray, but still Colette was the best performer. All of them were sprayed, but only Colette looks completely clean in the leaves with no signs of rust, black spot or powdery mildew.
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#2 of 11 posted
28 MAR 07 by
eve
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I've got two Colette and the places they are planted at are very different in soil quality. The better the better! The one's planted in a deeper soil is much more vigorous than the other.Still; even the one planted in the poor soil is a beautiful bush of 5 feet heights. Its secon flush is less generous than the firts, yet... Its a robust beautiful rose with very charming, delicate colour. I am glad t ohave her in my garden, even though I prefer old roses, she has practically all those qualities..Grettings, Eve
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#3 of 11 posted
5 MAR 08 by
Unregistered Guest
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mine is about 4yrs and it rarely bloom. I planted on the other side of the rose arbor, it recieved plenty of water and sunshine, but I thinks I only see it bloom once. I wonder what I have done wrong?
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I'm glad you are going well.
Henrique
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Very disappointed in this rose. It wilts quickly in the heat and also dislikes humidity. A so-so in terms of vigor. It has managed to survive and bloom regularly, but requires perfect weather to make a display.
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I’m not loving her either. She’s the first of my roses to bloom, but also the first to shut down in the heat, and she didn’t really give a fall flush this year either. I’m giving her one more year to show improvement.
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#11 of 11 posted
30 DEC 19 by
LaurelZ
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It’s the clay soil. If you are not willing to admend clay it’s not going to work out. I moved mine to my new house, but I removed huge amounts of dead clay soil and added good quality soil. Collette creates one or two good flushes a year, and rests in between. It’s not a hybrid tea.
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