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HMF Admin 
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Proven Winners has this listed as "Flavorette Pear'd™ Rosa x 'Bozdib023' USPPAF, Can PBRAF."
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On the surface this seems a bit suspect. The breeder code for this rose is 'BOZedib023' while the Plant Winners website, and others, reference the parent as 'Bozdib023' (note the missing 'e' as in "Editable rose") and we do not have Flavorette Pear'd™ listed on HMF as of yet - possibly a synonym for one our current listings. Time to start checking patents...
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Initial post
12 JUL 10 by
kev
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the rose pictured here is pink.Duc de Fitzjames is not this colour.It is a deep violet/purple and dark crimson red.
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The 'Vintage Book of Roses' says that there are two plants in commerce called 'Duc de Fitzjames', one darker than the other. Mine is lilac pink, similar to the flowers I see in the photos. My plant came from 'La Campanella' in Italy, but I don't know where they got their mother plant. According to Vintage the darker-flowered variety is likelier to be the correct one.
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Interesting, thanks for taking the time to sharing this insight with HelpMeFind. Just what HMF is all about - a tool to collect and disseminate gardening information to a participating online community.
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#3 of 9 posted
31 JUL 18 by
jedmar
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La Campanella has many of their Gallicas from Cour de Commer - the collection of François Joyaux. 'Duc de Fitzjames' in commerce is often 'Mme Lauriol de Barny', a Bourbon rose.
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I don't have 'Mme. Lauriol de Barny' in the garden and haven't seen it, at least not identified as such. I took a look at the newest page of photos of this variety on HMF, and, though I haven't made a careful comparison, right now I wouldn't swear that the rose I see in the photos isn't my 'Duc de Fitzjames'. My rose is a good tough variety with opulent blooms, coming easily from cuttings, has never reflowered later in the season, and gets some fungal disease after blooming, though not enough to do it any harm. Lanky in growth; thorny. I'm fond of it, mainly because of the very handsome blooms combined with the ability to flourish in quite poor conditions.
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#5 of 9 posted
4 AUG 18 by
jedmar
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Melissa, it would be very helpful if you could post some photos of your 'Duc de Fitzjames' on HMF.
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I'm a reluctant photographer (and this isn't the season anyway). I wanted to add to my description that my 'Duc de Fitzjames' sets hips, which are rounded oval, about 2cm wide and slightly longer, and smooth, the orifice not wide, sepals not persistent. They haven't matured yet so I don't know their color. A final note: my rose has long-lived canes, and suckers out, slowly and not aggressively.
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I came here to check on the color of this rose because last year it was a medium to light pink and this year it's quite dark with violet undertones. Would anyone know what would change the color.
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Is this rose on its own roots or is it grafted? Sometimes the rootstock of a grafted plant will send up its own cane that would be a different color than the scion.
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It's an own root that I bought as a cutting 3 years ago from High Country Roses. As he has come into full bloom, they seemed to have lightened a little, ut still not as light as they were last year. I will try to post a picture from a few days ago.
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Is the site down for maintenance? I cannot get any of the pages to open up this morning. Just renewed my membership this morning as well. Please let me know.
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Seems to be working okay for us, can you give a specific example please.
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#2 of 3 posted
7 APR 13 by
Jay-Jay
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Sometimes HMF is unavailable and the page stays blank.
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Working fine now. Must have been a hiccup of some kind.
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The Rose Captain Phillip Green sold by Guillot in France is Bon silene
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We have 'Bon Silene' listed as a different rose. Can you provide a reference indicating these rose are the same ?
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#2 of 15 posted
28 AUG 07 by
jedmar
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It should not be the same rose; George Graham means that the rose Guillot is selling, is actually 'Bon Silène' not 'Captain Philip Green'. There are unfortunately many such impostors in commerce.
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Thank you for the clarification.
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Two of your photos of Bon Silène and two of Captain Philip Green seem to be of an identical plant. All four photos have been contributed by Ami Roses.
It seems to me unclear that any of your photos of Captain Philip Green is correct. Paul Nabonnand, quoted on the www.rosarosam.com site, lists it as cream, as do you. Yet all your photos are of a very pink rose. Another site has "long bud opening to cream with carmine," which does not accurately describe any of your photos.
You quote a source of 1910 saying Captain Philip Green is "cream colour, in the way of Marie van Houtte". Since Marie van Houtte was the seed parent of Captain Philip Green, the similarity may be more genetic than casual. Your own photo ID 42196 of Marie van Houtte shows the exact effect: overall cream-straw colour with darker-than-pink staining of the outer petals.
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#5 of 15 posted
4 FEB 12 by
Darrell
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I currently have a young Capt. Philip Green from Vintage Gardens--still in a container. How tall and wide does this rose grow in the ground? (I live about 30 miles northeast of San Francisco, very Mediterranean climate.)
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#6 of 15 posted
13 DEC 14 by
AmiRoses
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No, all four photos are not the same plant.
Bon Silène is more carmine pink and often shows a white stripe.
Captain Ph. Green is more of a cream base and never has this white stripe.
The Buds are really cream with touches of carmine.
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The photos from Laikanl and Mulino san Genesio both show white stripes and therefore are likely to be 'Bon Silene'. If it is OK with them, I'll move the photos shortly.
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I'm late to this party, but none of these photos fits the description of a cream or light yellow rose with a light yellow, carmine-shaded bud. I agree that they do look like 'Bon Silène'.
Virginia
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I guess five years is more than adequate time for Laikanl and Mulino san Genesio to reply. I have reassigned their photos at least, to Bon Silene.
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#10 of 15 posted
28 JUL 19 by
jedmar
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The rose in L'Hay is also incorrectly labeled, but it is not pink enough to be 'Bon Silène'
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I agree that those photos don't look like 'Bon Silène'. It looks more like a Pernetiana to me. Would it be a good idea to have a separate record for "Captain Philip Green- in commerce"?
Virginia
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#12 of 15 posted
15 MAY by
odinthor
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I have created an "in commerce as" record, and moved the photos.
There are quite a few gardens claiming to have 'Captain Philip Green', and I would love to know if any of them have the original rose, or are they all 'Bon Silène', or this pretty HT-ish imposter? To me, the coloring of the latter resembles 'Shot Silk'...
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#14 of 15 posted
15 MAY by
odinthor
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Mine appears to be 'Bon Silène' (which I don't regret having!).
Do we know when/where/who started the distribution of 'Bon Silène' as 'Captain Philip Green'? (And same question for the origin of the HT/Pernetiana imposter.) If anyone has a full run of the Combined Rose List, one could at least see when 'Captain Philip Green' started being mentioned as available (and by whom) . . . unless it was already available when that publication started to appear.
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#15 of 15 posted
15 MAY by
jedmar
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'Captain Philip Green' is listed in the Guillot catalogue of 2000, but not in 1997.
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