HELPMEFIND PLANTS COMMERCIAL NON-COMMERCIAL RESOURCES EVENTS PEOPLE RATINGS
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Recent Questions, Answers and Comments
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Growing in z5b New Hampshire. Hot humid summers, cold wet winters. Quickly forms a massive, well shaped bush covered with healthy dark green foliage. Wider than tall. Better than averabe black spot resistance. First flush is impressive, covered in creamy white voluptuous blooms and prettily pointed apricot buds. The blooms are held more erect than many DA roses. Petal substance is good, holds up to rain and blooms are long lived. Slow to repeat, scattered later bloom. Great background shrub for its size and ample healthy foliage, which oordinates nicely with its Alba neighbor. Reliably hardy.
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According to Dominique Massad, Le Vésuve in commerce is actually Rosabelle (Bruant, 1899).
See in Bulletin n°25 Automne 2018, Roses Anciennes en France:
"L'ensemble de ces caractères me conduit à privilégier le nom de 'Rosabelle' pour cette variété commercialisée sous la dénomination erronée de 'Le Vésuve'."
He says that Le Vésuve in commerce doesn't ressemble a typical Bengal rose, at least what a Bengal rose would have been at the time (1825), but its habit is more one of a tea.
Any idea, comment, or personnal experience on that matter would be much appreciated!
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The Tea book authors quote Steen (1966) and Robinson (2001) as questioning the ID of the rose in commerce by this name.
I note, though, that Rosabelle is a climber.
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Very interesting!
Massad says that Le Vésuve grows up to 3m50, therefore somehow is a climber....
In my climate (zone 5) it is too cold for it to grow well, let alone climb so I cannot have an opinion on this matter.
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I suppose that raises the question, of whether there are two roses currently being sold as Le Vesuve - one a climber, one not. I don't grow it myself but the two plants I've seen, at Renmark (climate zone 9b, this week in a heatwave to 47C) aren't what I'd call climbers.
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If by any chance you had a picture....!
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I'll post a photo of the bush, which is the only one I have taken.
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I can well believe FDY is an ancestor of the rose sold as Le Vésuve which has a similar wiry growth habit and shape, sharpness and density of prickles seen on Fortune’s Double Yellow.
Photos of Rosabelle (Bruant, 1899) appear to be the same as those of Le Vésuve (Laffay, 1825) and Climbing Le Vésuve on HMF.
Does anyone know whether there is a plant of Rosabelle with an unbroken link to a reliably named old plant, or are we looking at photos of the same foundling with several suggested identities?
I have only seen the rose sold as Le Vésuve grown as a free-standing shrub, where it is either kept to a moderate-sized mound by very regular trimming, or allowed to form a much larger mound of long, prickly canes, interlocked by those vicious prickles. I’ve not seen it grown on a supporting structure to see how tall it grows as a climber.
I believe Dominique Massad's suggestion should be seriously considered.
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#7 of 10 posted
today by
 jedmar
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I had been looking at 'Rosabelle' at Tête d'Or (originating from L'Haÿ) in the context that it is a another seedling of Bruant from FDY, beside the lost 'Fée Opale'. FO is a good contender for the false 'Park's Yellow'. PY in commerce matches well the description of FO. It is a vigorous once-blooming climber, with foliage very similar to that of FDY. However, it does not have the nasty spiny prickles of FDY. At the time, I could not come to a conclusion. We should also remember that 'Hermosa' in commerce also has very nasty spines.
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Intriguing discussion. One problem though; would a seedling of FDY repeat as much as the rose in commerce as Le Vesuve does?
One of its seedling is described as having few prickles!
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The early refs mention this - running the French text through a translator: eg "..... a truly remontant rose bush. This character is very remarkable, given that it comes from the non-everbearing Yellow Fortune Rose." (Journal of the National Horticultural Society of France,1903) Page 469.)
and, from Horticultural Review Magazine (1900) Page 7 - "Two new sarmentous roses. — M. G. Bruant, horticulturist in Poitiers, to whom we already owe great gains in Roses (Rose Madame Georges Bruant, Rosa calocarpa, etc.), has just obtained two remarkable new features. Both will be put on sale. They come from the exquisite yellow Fortune’s Double Yellow, fertilized by various varieties of teas.
One of these Roses has a pearly white background, a yellowish center, and flesh pink edges. She will be called Fée Opale.
The other, with flowers in bouquets, light pink with salmon reflections, will be called Rosabelle. It is remontant, while the first is not."
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I absolutely agree that 'Fée Opale' seems right for the false Parks' Yellow and hope there will be a smoking gun to provide the final piece of evidence.
Jedmar - do you have access to any information regarding the provenance of L'Hay's Rosabelle?
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This rose was sold to me as Lagerfeld - at Home Depot or Lowes (can't remember which). It is clearly not. However, I love the fragrance and find it an attractive very vigorous rose. Anyone have ideas of what it could be?
Very strong old rose and myrrh fragrance
Vigorous grower, multiple blooms in each flowering, constant flowering
Matte, light green darkening to medium green leaves
I'm in zone 6b - heavy clay soil, full sun spot that gets afternoon shade after 4
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#1 of 1 posted
today by
HubertG
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Could it be 'Fragrant Plum', another Christensen rose?
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My plant had wonderful clusters of white roses but these don't lose their petals and hang as brown festoons from mid-July onwards.
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