"Ayrshire Queen - in commerce as" rose reviews and comments

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"Ayrshire Queen - in commerce as" rose Reviews & Comments

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Discussion id : 76-194 most recent 4 SEP 19 SHOW ALL

Initial post 23 JAN 14 by HMF supporting member

JJS

Thomas Rivers writes in The Rose Amateur’s Guide (2nd ed. 1840) “...Ayrshire Queen, the only dark Ayrshire Rose known, was originated by myself, in 1835, from the blush Ayrshire, impregnated with the Tuscany Rose. But one seed germinated; and the plant produced has proved a complete hybrid. Its flowers are of the same shape, and not more double than those of the blush Ayrshire, its female parent; but they have all the dark-purplish crimson of the Tuscany Rose. It has lost a portion of the vigorous climbing habit of the Ayrshire, but yet makes an excellent pillar rose. Till we can get a dark Ayrshire rose, double as a Ranunculus, it will be acceptable.”

So why is everyone here showing pictures of 'Splendens' under the name of 'Ayrshire Queen'?

Reply #1 of 11 posted 24 JAN 14 by HMF supporting member

Margaret Furness

Reply #2 of 11 posted 25 JAN 14 by HMF supporting member

hannes

Part of the problem is that there are nurseries who have known for some years about the "last line of the description" but don't bother ... still are selling the rose under the wrong name	REPLY

Reply #3 of 11 posted 26 JAN 14 by HMF supporting member

Margaret Furness

Reply #4 of 11 posted 27 JAN 14 by HMF supporting member

jedmar

There are two entries for Ayrshire Queen: - one, 'Ayrshire Queen' is the dark red rose by Rivers - the other, "Ayrshire Queen" is the false rose in commerce - probably identical to 'Ayrshire Splendens'. This is remarked in the Notes. For clarification, the second has received an attribute (in commerce as).	REPLY

Reply #5 of 11 posted 28 JAN 14 by HMF supporting member

JJS

Thanks. The European Nurserystock Association (ENA) lists 'Ayrshire Queen' as a synonym of the preferred name 'Splendens'. Perhaps HMF should follow this, and move the contents of 'Ayrshire Queen' to 'Splendens' instead of having a separate entry as if it were a different variety.	REPLY

Reply #6 of 11 posted 28 JAN 14 by HMF supporting member

hannes

I'm not sure why ENA or anyone else would want to list 'Ayrshire Queen' as a synonym for 'Splendens'. These are two different roses after all. Doesn't matter if someone sells 'Splendens' wrongly as 'Ayrshire Queen' or posts incorrectly named photos on a website.	REPLY

Reply #7 of 11 posted 28 JAN 14 by HMF supporting member

Patricia Routley

Reply #8 of 11 posted 3 SEP 19 by HMF supporting member

Patricia Routley

Please see the two references for "Ayrshire Queen (in commerce as)".	REPLY

Reply #9 of 11 posted 3 SEP 19 by HMF supporting member

jedmar

Hannes, can you Elaborate on the differences between 'Ayrshire Queen' and 'Splendens'. I agree with you that the commercial interests of nurseries cannot be the deciding factor to have them as synonyms. We have today a lot of issues with unscrambling roses which wrre declared as synonyms in the 1880s, and we should not repeat the same error.	REPLY

Reply #10 of 11 posted 3 SEP 19 by HMF supporting member

hannes

Hi Jedmar,
I'm not sure why you'd want me to elaborate on the differences between 'Ayrshire Queen' (AQ) and 'Splendens'? The differences between the "real" AQ and 'Splendens' are well documented on HMF in the References sections of the respective roses.

If you refer to differences between the rose "in commerce as" AQ and 'Splendens' the situation might be somewhat more difficult because there may be two (or more) cultivars around that are grown/sold under the name 'Splendens'. However, I have no experience with such different forms of 'Splendens', just read about them.

Anyway, I am glad that HMF does not list AQ as a synonym for 'Splendens'. Currently quite a number of German rose nurseries have AQ as synonym for 'Splendens' or 'Ayrshire Splendens' and AQ as the preferred name. One of the largest of these rose nurseries lists 'Ayrshire Queen' syn. R. arvensis-Hybr., 'Ayrshire Splendens' and additionally (!) sells another cultivar as 'Ayrshire Splendens'. The descriptions for these two roses sound very similar to me...

Reply #11 of 11 posted 4 SEP 19 by HMF supporting member

jedmar

Yes, I was thinking about the differences between 'Ayrshire Queen' in commerce and 'Splendens'. I know who to ask and will see if I can get a reply.	REPLY

Discussion id : 28-936 most recent 14 JUL 08 HIDE POSTS

Initial post 14 JUL 08 by kahlenberg

i am not perfectly sure, if it is really "ayrshire queen" that i cultivate, could be "ayrshire splendens as well. anyway - i like it very much and tried it out on different places. i think, the best thing is to let it grow into other bushes or trees, where it isn´t exposed to strong sunlight all day long. not to be grown on sunny walls! very good for dry areas and poor soil (don´t fertilize this rose). very hardy and vigorous but graceful in growth. won´t become bare-branched with age like many other climbers, because fresh shoots come out of the ground even on old exemplars. slightly susceptible to mildew, but it won´t do much harm. the flowers are semi-double and most of them keep there globular form till the end. rain doesn´t do as much harm to them as dry hot weather after misty mornings. the spicy scent can be impressing (depending on weather). one of the first to bloom and for quite a long time (5 - 6 weeks), too. sets beautiful and rather large hips.